good sunday afternoon. i'm craig melvin. you're watching msnbc. here's what's happening right now. egypt on guard. security forces surround government buildings, and now officials are taking on foreign journalists. we're live in cairo. plus -- >> it is well past time to implement common-accepsense cha from coast to coast. >> and rethinking the law. attorney general eric holder drops mandatory minimum sentences for lower-level offenders. what that could mean for a criminal justice system. something like a tornado. it shouldn't take his -- they're supposed to be safe at school.

>> keeping kids safe. sheltering students in oklahoma could cost $1 billion. but there's a group that's decided to help raise some money. meet the man behind today's big idea. we'll get to all those stories in just a moment. but we start in egypt, where just moments ago u.s. officials confirm the obama administration is considering canceling the delivery of apache helicopters to egypt this fall. they war part of a 2009 sale to help the country's military protect its borders. meanwhile, protesters are back on the streets after another day of deadly clashes. security forces and armored vehicles have lined up to guard egypt's supreme constitutional court, along with entrances to cairo's tahrir square. they're back open to traffic with a heavy military presence as the work week begins there. the news conference this morning, egypt's foreign minister vowed to continue working toward a political

solution. he also suggested that they plan to review the benefits of foreign aid from the united states and other countries. and clashes, clashes came to a head yesterday, as police stormed a mosque in cairo, where protesters had been holed up since friday. ethe egyptian government says now 79 people were killed. aman mohadin are in cairo. we're hearing security forces have now started raids the homes of muslim brotherhood members. what more can you tell us about that? >> reporter: that's right. in fact, the security forces here have been really stepping up their campaign against the muslim brotherhood ever since they launched that assault on two major protests on wednesday. in the eyes of the egyptian government, they're the only ones to blame. the muslim brotherhood they have inferred through state-controlled media, that they are a terrorist organization. so they have on one hand

demonized them through a lot of the government-opened media channels, but at the same time, today for the first time, the commander of the armed forces who led the removal of mohamed morsi, actually implied there was political space in the country for the muslim brotherhood. but they had to make a choice to renounce violence. but right now on the streets that's a very different story. as you mentioned, security forces have rounded up some of the organization's most top senior leaders, at the same time they have killed some of their members. and there are still a lot more that are on the run, that security forces here want. not to mention that the country's former president is still in detention, and is being investigated by the country's prosecutor general. so a lot of mixed signals coming out of the egyptian government about the future of the muslim brotherhood. keep in mind, yesterday the egyptian cabinet said it was discussing legal ways to possibly disband and ban for life the muslim brotherhood. >> while all of this is happening, of course, word this

morning, that you guys, the foreign press, is now under tighter scrutiny as well. what's that about? >> reporter: the egyptian government has really gone on the pr offensive here in the last 24 hours. a series of press conferences from the presidential palace to the foreign minister, minister of information, and the armed forces, all of them really essentially cast gating western media, saying the western media was not portraying this conflict as it should be. this is not a political dispute, this is a war on terrorism, and they want the western media, and really global media to reflect that. the local media has really bought into the government line. if you watch most of the private egyptian channels, egyptian newspapers, they portray the muslim brotherhood as a terrorist organization. they simply see the military and interim government as doing no wrong. when there's any krit tism from particularly international

media, that seems to draw the irate reaction of the government. the foreign minister this afternoon held a press conference that bizarrely lasted for several hours. and also handed out to journalists packets on how they should be covering this conflict. slightly a bizarre press conference, but one that has drawn criticism there media itself. >> gave you press kits, okay. ayman, be safe, my friend. let's get to peter suitorman, senior editor of "reason" magazine, and political editor for the grio. pete, let me start with you, sir. president obama, of course, he condemned the government action in egypt from martha's vineyard last week. and we won't be joining in military exercises with egypt. but what real power, peter, does president obama have to change what's happening on the ground

in egypt? >> president obama does not have real direct power to change what's happening on the ground in egypt, but what he does have the power to do is decide how we're going to react, what the american response is going to be. and right now america gives about $1.5 billion a year in aid to cairo, $1.3 billion of that is military aid. and that's the kind of thing that obama could be seriously rethinking, and saying, you know, what are we getting for that money, is it in our interests, in the interests of the egyptian people. >> christine, the president's hands, are they tied? or are they not? are there options that are available to the president that we have not been talking about over the past few days? >> craig, egypt is a very important ally to the united states, which is why the president is hesitating in cutting off further economic aid. most of the military aid for this fiscal year has already been given to egypt. there are four f-16s that haven't been delivered, maybe some helicopters. but egypt is a strong strategic

partner. we have flyovers over egypt that maintains stability in the region. the suez canal is important to egypt. but coming after the -- our experience in russia, with snowden, and putin thumbing their nose at the united states, i think there are some people concerned that we spent weeks trying to negotiate a deal with egypt and prevent this bloodshed, and we weren't able to do so. and some of them are pressuring the president to consider future aid and set down groundwork for delivering that aid in the future. >> let's talk domestic politics now. specifically, new york city stop and frisk program. the city, of course, has appealed the federal judge's ruling, saying stop and frisk is unconstitutional. ray kelly was on "meet the press" this morning, strongly defending the controversial policy. let's listen to what he said and talk about it on the other side. here it is. >> if a program like stop and frisk is abandoned, will people

die? >> well, i think no question about it, violent crime will go up. again, this is not a program. this is something that's integral to policing. this happens throughout america. and any police jurisdiction. you have to do it. officers have to have the right of inquiry, if they see some suspicious behavior. >> is there some happy medium, perry, between what the city wants to do and what minority communities and civil libertarians feel infringes on their rights? >> yeah, a political problem here is, ray kelly, blik al bloomberg, very unpopular with a lot of the minority leaders in new york city. i don't think any solution they brought to the table would be viewed as a compromise. i think some of the mayoral candidates talking about replacing him, ultimately, i think any policy where the minority leaders like, 80% of people currently targeted by

this program are minorities. as long as the nush is going to be that high, you're always going to have a political problem there. and people concerned by it. until whatever compromise has the minority community not feeling like they're targeted. >> christine, one solution suggested by the judge when she overturned stop and frisk, is for police officers to wear this sort of body camera, so to speak that would record any interaction between police and some of the people that they are stopping and frisking. is that something that would help soothe the concerns that many folks have about this particular program? >> you know, i noticed, craig, that this morning ray kelly said that that would be a detriment and police wouldn't be able to do that. but i think that's a weak excuse, because police officers carry cameras when they do basic traffic stops in many states across the country and they turn them on when they engage someone. importantly as well, her decision says, it's

unconstitutional as it is now. she's not saying you can't have stop and frisk, but when you have an instance here where you have 90% of the stops that do not result in an arrest or a warrant, you have many police officers, in facts, the most common excuse they give for stopping someone, is someone had furtive activity. they were changing the direction they were moving. or they had their hand in their pocket. 50% of the people are frisked and only 1.5% of those cases is a gun or weapon found. clearly this program has gone broad and been implemented broader than it needs to be to protect ourselves. >> another thing bloomberg did on friday, announced on friday, added new fuel to the fire. he was asked about crime and security, specifically in new york city's public housing projects. this is what the mayor said about that. take a listen. >> the people that live there, most of them, want more police protection. they want more police. if you have strangers walking in

the halls of your apartment building, don't you want somebody to stop and say, who are you, why are you here? >> mayor bloomberg proposing finger printing, more than 620,000 people. peter, is mayor bloomberg, is he disconnected, or indifferent? >> well, i think -- i mean, maybe he's both. with mayor bloomberg, you know, he really seems to think that the best solution to any problem is -- that new york government and for him to come in and order some sort of incredibly invasive action. and whether that's the fingerprinting-he said people want more policing in unsafe environments. that's probably true. but they don't look for things, they're not looking for invasive policing. they're looking for the kind of policing that works. hot spot policing, things like that. the kind of policing where the policemen are neighbors, you know, part of the neighborhood, part of the community. that's not what he's saying

here. what he's proposing is in fact incredibly invase itch. and something that people are going to react negatively to. you said already minorities have a negative opinion of mayor bloomberg. this is one of the reasons why. >> i guess also when you're not running for reelection, it makes it easy, too. brain trust is going to come back a little bit later in the hour. voters legalized it, but how do states regulate it. coming up, we're going to head out west to see what's made enacting those new marijuana laws a tad bit more difficult than we thought it might be. philadelphia's drastic measures to open schools on time, but will it be enough. and is this the end of the road for san diego's embattled mayor? the new grass roots effort to remove him from office kicks off today. nt when you're running a successful business. so we provide it services you can rely on. with centurylink as your trusted it partner,

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attorney general eric holder's plan to no longer pursue mandatory minimum sentences for some nonviolent offenses could ease the overcrowded prison systems. with this country's public prison spilling over, we've seen a rise of a new industry. in our special report presumed guilty, examining just how big the business of privately run prisons has become. >> too many americans go to too many prisons for far too long, and for no truly good law enforcement reason. >> attorney general eric holder took a rare step to curb the war on drugs in his speech to the american bar association, launching a policy to seek less federal jail time for certain nonviolent offenses. over the past 30 years, mandatory minimums have driven up the prison population by

700%. the attorney general says it disproportionately impacts the poor. they increasingly turn to corporations to pick up the slack. an advocate for criminal justice reform has visited hundreds of prisons. >> the war on drugs is not a war on drugs, as a war against blacks in america. in the past 20 years, you've allowed that war to be profited by private prisons. >> for-profit prisons began winning contracts to run entire jail facilities in the 1980s, when the inmate population was spiking. from 1990 to 2009, the private prison industry ballooned by 1,600% according to the aclu. >> they are now making contracts with states, saying guaranteed, that our prison will be filled. guaranteed that we'll make a profit. and how do you guarantee that? you create drug laws. >> the companies running these prisons say they meet a public

need filling policies. both parties have looked to private prisons to address overcrowding. take cca, founded in 1983, and now the largest private prison group in the country with 80,000 inmates in 16 states. the company says it provides a cost savings of business, to the oversight of government. ccs spent almost $15 million lobbying in 32 states between 2003 and 2010. yet cca officials insist they do not lobby for longer prison terms. in an s.e.c. filing the company was required to submit in 2010, however, it conceded that its business may be hurt by policies of leniency and conviction or parole standards and sentencing practice also. and that's the point. the war on drugs has spawned a powerful business model that needs more crime and more jail time to survive. a system that presumes guilt as a business model, and recidivism as a bonus. >> when you get out, if you're a criminal and come back, we would

love to see you again. >> mark mauer is the executive director at the sentencing project, michael skolnick that you just saw in the report is the editor in chief at the global grind.com. let's look at the numbers here. since mandatory citizen sentencing, we've seen a 700% rise in prison population, 1600% jump in the private prison population. what are the implications of prisons profiting from this so-called war on drugs? >> the real implication is we have the highest number of people incarcerated in the world. we have packed these prisons, hotels if you will, with black and brown men from across this country. how do we end the war on drugs and mandatory minimum sentencing? 97%, 97% of drug offenses take a plea. they take this horrible drug

law, scare the living crap out of young men going before the judge and take 25 to life or 18 months. the young kid says, i can do 18 months. they go back once, they go back again and again and again. >> the cycle continues. you mentioned the shear number of people in prisons regardless of public or private. of course, we know this at this point, the united states incarcerates a higher percentage of people than any other country in the free world. roughly 1.5 million people in local and federal jails all over this country, the attorney general earlier this week saying he wants to change those numbers. this is part of what he said. >> this is why i have today mandated a modification of the justice department's charging policy so certain low-level, nonviolent drug offenders who have no ties to large-scale organizations or cartels will no longer be charged with offenses that impose draconian mandatory prison sentences. >> mark, what's the overall impact of that change?

>> well, what it's going to do is now we now have a one size fits all mandatory sentencing policy, that congress and legislative bodies have adopted. this takes away any discretion from the judge, in looking at factors that may have contributed to the crime. and recognizing no two crimes, no two offenders are alike. i think the attorney general's move is basically a message to his prosecutors that if there are cases that don't require 5, 10, 20-year prison term, you should charge them in a way that that won't be the result. i think that will help to lessen, at least some of the federal prisons, the numbers of people getting these relatively punitive sentences. >> marc, how would the sentencing guidelines impact the arres arrests, especially in the minority community? especially for marijuana possession. what is this change specifically going to mean for that group?

>> it's not going to mean anything directly for them. if we really worry about mass incarceration, we have to attack it on several fronts. the attorney general has the power to deal with federal courts and what's going on there. law enforcement, how local police make arrests, what kinds of drugs they're going after, whether they go after kingpins or kids on the corner. all those decisions are made by police chiefs, by local mayors and the like. that's where we need to start making some changes as well. >> mike, while i have you here, i know you're sick of talking about this, but i have to ask you about your boss, and that video, that tape, harry tubman, of course. we're not going to show it here. it's all over the internet, the video that shows a depiction of harriet tubman having sex with her master, to allow her to run the underground railroad. russ em simmons has since apologized. but what was he thinking? how did that happen? >> i think it was a horrible mistake. i think the video is incredibly

offensive and horrific and insensitive. i'm proud that russell saw very quickly the reaction, and acted very quickly, removing the video immediately, issuing an apology immediately. i know this man. i've known him for ten years. i worked with him for four and a half years. and people say, he gets a paycheck from russell and will say whatever he wants him to say. i don't believe this. this man has done a tremendous amount of work for communities across this country and will continue to do the work. he is pained by what he has caused and will do anything he can to fix it. i think he's done a lot already. i go to work tomorrow morning for him, with him, to continue the work. there's drug law reform, and private prison reform, and prison reform in general. all the good things we've done in the 4 1/2 years together, i'm proud of it. i stand by him. but i certainly found that video as offensive as anyone else who watched it in the past few days. >> always good to see you. thank you so much for your time.

marc mauer down in d.c. with the sentencing project. big thanks to you as well. you can find much more about our presumed guilty series, on msnbc's website. we will be right back. ur commito the gulf, bp had two big goals: help the gulf recover and learn from what happened so we could be a better, safer energy company. i can tell you - safety is at the heart of everything we do. we've added cutting-edge technology, like a new deepwater well cap and a state-of-the-art monitoring center, where experts watch over all drilling activity twenty-four-seven. and we're sharing what we've learned, so we can all produce energy more safely. our commitment has never been stronger.

when you hear that your school is the safest place to be and it blows away, literally everything around you goes up in the sky, you no longer feel safe. >> that was danny leg. she lives in moore, oklahoma. her son, christopher, died in the may 20th, tornado, that tore through that town. 25 people died that day, including seven children at plaza towers elementary. she and her husband pulled their remaining two children and enrolled them in the only school in moore that currently has a storm shelter. a nonprofit group called shelter

oklahoma schools, s.o.s. they're trying to build tornado proof shelters in every school in the state. john hunt started shelter oklahoma schools. john, good to see you. >> thank you, craig. not fair to say i did it alone, but i was certainly integral in the process. >> on friday, students in moore returned to a new but temporary plaza towers elementary. but this building also does not have a storm shelter. why not? >> i'm unable to answer that question. we are not about looking towards the past, we are about looking towards the future. so we are a private group that haes come together to try to raise as much money as possible over all of the ensuing years, and let's do everything we can to get a shelter in every school that does not have one. >> at the root of this, according to the principal, at plaza towers, kids don't feel safe. >> i'm afraid that they've lost the trust. and that they've lost the

security that we had before may 20th. >> how do you rebuild that trust? >> i don't know the answer to that. and i'm not a principal or superintendent. that being said, i will say, superintendent romine, the new superintendent of moore schools, has reached out to us, and been just wonderful with trying to work with us, in the future, to get -- make sure that he has shelters in every one of these schools that he oversees. >> you've estimated that the price tag to put shelters in the more than 1,600 schools in oklahoma will probably be upwards of $1 billion. how do you pay for that? >> well, again, i don't have all the answers. what i do know is it's going to take a tremendous amount of money. we are not a political organization. we are a private organization that intends to work with political entities, be it the state, be it the municipality, the county, what have you.

hopefully, we can fill the gap between the funding they provide, but if they're unwilling to provide the funding, then we need to raise a heck of a lot of money, and let's get this going. >> what can people do if they want to help? >> absolutely, go to www.shelteroklahomaschools.org. you can go to our facebook page, or text the word safety to donate $10. >> john hunt, it is our sunday big idea. john, thank you. and do you have a big idea that's making a difference? tell us about it by e-mailing us at big idea.msnbc@nbcuni.com.

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it was very painful situation. the rash was on my right hip, going all the way down my leg. i'm very athletic and i swim in the ocean. shingles forced me out of the water. the doctor asked me "did you have chickenpox when you were a child?" the pain level was so high, it became unbearable. new evacuations overnight as the massively wildfire in idaho continues to intense fi. at least 2,300 homes are now in

harm's way. more than 700 firefighters are working around the clock attacking that inferno from the air, and on the ground. dry air and gusty conditions there. gusty winds are fueling the flames which have now wurnd more than 100,000 acres since that fire started 11 days ago. so far, the fire has scorched an area about the size of denver, colorado. welcome back to msnbc. i'm craig melvin. here's a quick look at some of the other top stories making news on a sunday afternoon. in san diego, new efforts are under way to oust mayor bob filner from office. women are accusing the 74 making inappropriate statements or sexual advances. filner said he's not resigning. now volunteers are collecting signatures for a petition that would force a recall election. they'll need just over 100,000 signatures by september 26th to force him from office. a new development in the

jerry sandusky case. the first civil claim brought by one of sandusky's victims has been settled. the lawyer for the man known as victim number five in court documents could not reveal details but said the compensation was fair. penn state still faces 25 other lawsuits. the university has set aside $60 million for payouts. and an active defiance in russia. two female athletes kissed on the podium in moscow this weekend. they had just wub a world championship in track and field. this is russia's sports minister, insisting russia's anti-gay laws will not infringe on the private lives of athletes and spectators at next year's winter olympics. this summer we've already seen one major metropolitan city file for bankruptcy, now another city is trying to keep its school system from going belly-up. last week, the philadelphia school system got a $50 million

emergency loan. without the money, they wouldn't have been able to open its schools on time. the $50 million will only pay for minimal staffing, which means schools have to reduce extracurricular activities. but the money is only a slice of the $304 million deficit the district is facing. earlier this summer, the district was forced to lay off nearly 4,000 teachers, and so far only about 1,000 have been rehired. business study numbers for one of the nation's largest school districts that serves more than 190,000 students. former pennsylvania governor, ed rendell, joins me live now. governor rendell, thanks for joining us. a school system facing an estimated $304 million deficit. it has to pay roughly $280 million to service its existing debt every year, i understand. how did your city get here? >> well, a number of things

combined, po put it in this strait. but most of all it was significant underfunding from harrisburg. they wound up getting $600 million more annually to meet the needs of its kids, for pre-kindergarten, technology in the classroom, after-school tut tutoring. much of that money was cut. in fairness to governor corbin, when he took over we were in the worst of the part of the recession and revenues were down. know with standing the fact revenues were down, they gave a significant cut to businesses and business taxes, and they refused to tax the shale industry. pennsylvania remains the only major state in the union that has shale that doesn't enact a severance tax. those two things would produce another $400 million to $500 million much that could go to schools. these are not just in philadelphia, in all the 500 districts throughout the state. >> i was reading about philadelphia specifically, and found it interesting that

philadelphia also does not have a board of education. walk us through how financial decisions are made for the school district in philadelphia. >> well, for the last 10 or 11 years, the district's been run by the school reform commission. the mayor appoints team members and the governor appoints three. it's not a school board. previous to that the mayor appointed the school board. during my eight years as governor, 40,000 more children made proficiency in reading and math. that's a pretty good record. they didn't cure all the problems of the district, everybody not. but that's how it's governed right now. and one of the biggest problems also is that the union -- and the union is headed by a terrific guy by the name of jerry jordan -- the union has here t for not been able to cooperate with some of the work rules saving the district significant money without hurting the teachers by and large. the union's going to have to

show flexibility if we're ever going to convince harrisburg to step up and fund the schools again. >> the district is now asking for about $120 million more from the state. governor corbett said he will not release that funding until the schools in philadelphia meet certain criteria. governor, how is this going to play out? >> first of all, understand the 120 is not from the state itself. it's from the federal government, a supplement of a prior claim that the city had with the federal government. and allowing the city to extend the increase in the sales tax and apply that to education. in this big fight, harrisburg only came up with $15 million out of the $304 million that the city needed to raise. so harris puburg's got to do mo. the union is going to have to show flexibility if that happens, and the mayor and city council have got to get together to find a way to allocate that sales tax basically to education. i don't know about the union,

i'm hopeful, as i said, jerry jordan will see the light and make some of the necessary concessions. nobody likes to make concessions, craig, but this is a time when the school kids have to come first ahead of everything. >> governor ed rendell, thank you very much for stopping by to shed light on what's happening with the schools in philadelphia. >> thank you. regulating the business of pot. the marijuana laws that still have to be worked out. jackie ] it's just so frustrating... ♪ the middle of this special moment and i need to run off to the bathroom. ♪ i'm fed up with always having to put my bladder's needs ahead of my daughter. ♪ so today, i'm finally talking to my doctor about overactive bladder symptoms. [ female announcer ] know that gotta go feeling? ask your doctor about prescription toviaz. one toviaz pill a day significantly reduces sudden urges and accidents, for 24 hours. if you have certain stomach problems or glaucoma,

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events of the 1960s. obvious transition here, perhaps. washington state and colorado legalized recreational marijuana use in their states last year. but putting the laws into practice has been anything but smooth sailing. with pot still illegal on a federal level, there are a number of hurdles, including how to regulate the marketplace. cnbc's jane wells with more on the challenges ahead. >> craig, welcome to the mile high city. this is legal medical cannabis. you still can't grow or sell recreational pot yet, but it's coming. in the meantime, no matter how you get your pot, if you got 'em, you can smoke 'em. either here in colorado or in washington state where these pictures were shot. if you're at least 21 years old, only have an ounce but you can't resell it. there's quite a few differences between the two laws.

but it turns out nothing has been easy in enacting these new regulations. labeling, tracking, all of that has turned out to be a little more difficult. for example, in washington, they're deciding they're going to cap production so that too much pot isn't grown and it ends up being exported out of state which would really anger the feds. >> we have to determine what the production level needs to be in the state to meet the needs of those over 21. and from there, we have to create a model for how many producers do you need, how many processors and retailers to meet that production limit. typically you don't have to limit that marketplace to start it, which is what we're being asked to do here. >> our most popular days. >> i wonder why. >> the joint, medical pot dispensary in seattle, the big concern is whether these businesses can be operated through bank accounts and not be all cash.

one bank account has already been shut down. >> if they want to make all this tax money here in washington and colorado, they've got to give us some banking. >> colorado got a jump in establishing in a system to track pot. other areas of the new law, there are still kinks that need to be worked out. >> the most discouraging thing about the new law is that we still don't know a couple of the things having to do with packaging. it's very hard to get ready for adult use, which is merely five months away, without having all the data points of what's expected. >> everyone seems to think it's all going to work out, and they're actually going to be selling this stuff at a retail level in washington and colorado sometime next year. but there is one problem, this remains completely illegal on a federal level. washington, d.c., has not told either state what, if anything, it plans to do. craig? >> all right. jane wells for us there. jane, thank you. speaking of marijuana, today's the final day of seattle's

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. count it. count it. talk about a lucky shot for incoming ball state university freshman marcus. that lucky shot not only brought cheers from the crowd, won him an entire year of free tuition, which is worth about $11,000. marcus is apparently the first person to ever sink that shot. congrats and kudos to him and

his family. peter and also msnbc contributor and christine from straight scoop power politics, let's get straight to your headlines for next week. peter, i'll start with you down in d.c. what say you, so? what's the headline? >> democrats increasingly troubled by nsa surveillance. i think the report in "the washington post" showing that there were more than 2700 incidents in which the nsa broke and violated is going to get more press. democrats are already reacting negatively to it. we've seen patrick leahy on the senate judiciary saying that he's going to hold hearings. even nancy pelosi who has been supportive of the president here says she's quite troubled and regular critics like senator ron

wyden have released a letter saying this is the only the tip of the iceberg. there's still a lot we don't know. >> harry, what are you hearing down there? is this something that has already got the far left up in arms or much to do about nothing? >> they voted to defund this program a month ago. i think you're going to have real issues when the congress gets back. there's been a lot of pushback. you can see the people that supported the president, kind of pulling back. this is going to be a big issue. if you you're looking for the obama scandal, as the republicans are, this is going to be a big issue. >> nsa? >> nsa. >> christine, what's your headline? >> i actually picked the same one that he did. so i'm going to change mine. i'm going to say that the rnc -- >> first of all, you're new to this one, christine, so we'll let you pass this one. we'd like for our headlines to be shorter and more clever than that. >> okay. i'll work on that for next week.

thanks. here's my bulletproof vest. i need the vest. >> it sounds like you think the nsa scandal is not going to be something that we stop talking about a week from now or two weeks from now, which is typically the case with the washington scandals. >> snowden had given information to "the washington post" that came out last week. who knows what he has planned for the coming weeks between now and whenever he gets back. second, i think congress, when they get back, if they don't deal with this and nip in the bud, they've got to deal with it in early september because they have the budget and everything else. it's going to keep mushrooming and expanding and then the president and the hill are going to have to deal with this for months and months and months. >> peter, there was something said here on the broadcast yesterday which really stayed with me. we were talking about stop and frisk and he said, forget stop and frisk for a moment. what we have seen over the past

12 months has essentially been an attack on the fourth amendment in this country. time and time again, i would imagine, peter, that would be an assessment that you would agree with. no? >> certainly. and i think the reason we're going to see a lot of talk about these new revelations is that they go to the heart of obama's defense of the nsa program which he said there's been no specific accusations of abuse and the oversight is very good but in fact what we've seen here is there are thousands of abuses and instances in which they violated their guidelines and the oversight is not very good because the judges who are doing the oversight just have to rely on what the government gives them. >> we have not heard from the white house on the latest revelations regarding the nsa. the president, of course, on martha's vineyard, has not responded to that. it will be interesting to see how he squares that response from the white house a week prior to the nsa revelations. >> he's going to update those

comments because "the washington post," if you read it carefully, informed dianne feinstein that the rules were not going to follow and you've been saying up until now, this is going to be an issue that we keep talking about. i said still marching for the marches going on this week but the march is formally called the march for jobs and freedom. i think you should hear more talk about that, the problem with the racial justice in the country but with jobs in the country. black unemployment is still double what white unemployment is. the wealth gap continues to grow and i think you'll hear more from the president and also the people at the marches talking about it as well as voting rights and traditional civil rights issues. >> 1953 we saw a quarter of a million people down there in d.c. is there any idea how large the

crowd is going to be this week? >> i would assume tens and thousands. i wouldn't expect anything like a few years ago. >> we, of course, are planning a great deal of special coverage next week in honor of the 50th anniversary of the march on washington. we encourage you, of course, to follow our coverage on the air and online. peter, big thanks to you. perry from the grio and christine from the street politics, thanks to you as well. >> short, funny headline. >> just clever. >> thank you so much. we always enjoy having you on. and a big thanks to you. watch our special coverage for the 50th anniversary on washington. first, "disrupt with karen finney." disrupters, get ready.

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